How to control Pro Tools faders from an Akai MPK 249
Hello,
I am a Pro Tools engineer and am looking for a method to connect Pro Tools with my Akai MPK 249 Controller. Specifically, the Akai MPK has eight faders and rotary knobs that can be assigned to any tracks in Pro Tools but Akai doesn't have any built-in method to do this for Pro Tools. They DO offer this for other DAW's as I've used it in Logic.
Akai Support actually directed me to SoundFlow and before I commit to a subscription I need to know how much of an effort it will take for me to get up to speed. Again, my needs are very specific and very limited but I am not a script writer unless you go back twenty years to batch commands in Windows. I now use a Mac.
So having said this if someone could let me know if this application would do what I need without a steep learning curve I would appreciate it.
Thanks!
Chris Shaw @Chris_Shaw2020-12-17 18:49:42.690ZHey Rick,
I just did a cursory look at the MPK manual and it seems that the faders and knobs send standard MIDI controller information. On most DAW these can be assigned to various faders and pan knobs in the DAW's mixer. However this sort of functionality is not available in PT (there are ways of using it to control plugins but that is another post altogether… 🙂 )
What you would need is a way to convert MID CC messages to HUI (which is the protocol the PT uses to control faders and knobs).
This is a little bit beyond my abilities but perhaps @JesperA could chime in here…
- RRick Kilbashian @Rick_Kilbashian
Hi Chris!
Thanks for the clarification.
At one point (recently) I had a ticket open with Akai Support and they pointed me to SoundFlow. Again, if anyone can tell me how difficult this would be to control the Akai MPK 249's Faders and Knobs with Pro Tools 2020 I'd be grateful.BTW, I am running macOS Catalina version 10.15.7 (19H15)
Christian Scheuer @chrscheuer2020-12-17 21:57:28.292ZHere's an example on the kind of script that you'd need to make:
- Christian Scheuer @chrscheuer2020-12-17 21:58:52.865Z
The script in the quoted thread takes the incoming MIDI from an external device and converts it to HUI messages that it sends to Pro Tools.
The way to get this set up would be to start with faders and get them to work, since SoundFlow already has pre-made HUI actions for controlling faders. To control stuff like Pan or other things, you'd need to dive a little deeper (this would include looking into the HUI protocol specs).
- In reply toChris_Shaw⬆:
Jesper Ankarfeldt @JesperA2020-12-19 07:49:27.710ZChristian beat me to it (as most often, haha)
Yeah, I've actually worked sending MIDI from Nuendo (an automated volume) to Pro Tools because I was trying to make a more streamlined delivery process.
In the end I didn't go that way, but the script I used for prof of concept is similar to what Christian posted. I'll include the script below still, but I would read through and use Christians post as it's more thorough.So this takes the incoming CC7 message (The trigger is obvious a midi device) and sends it to Pro Tools.
var firstFaderCC = 7; var numberOfFaders = 1; var m = event.trigger.midiBytes; var m0 = m[0], m1 = m[1], m2 = m[2]; //log(m,'') if (m0 == 0xb0 && m2 >= firstFaderCC && m1 <= (firstFaderCC + numberOfFaders - 1)) { var val = m2 * 127; sf.midi.huiFader({ faderNum: m1 - firstFaderCC + 1, value: val, touchAndRelease: true, }); }- Christian Scheuer @chrscheuer2020-12-19 13:40:31.199Z
Thanks for sharing, Jesper.
@Rick_Kilbashian the code here actually illustrates a couple of the most obvious limitations when using the HUI protocol as a conversion step, when a device doesn't natively support it.
One is that we have to simulate a touch down on the fader, then a fader move, then a touch release. This is because the HUI protocol needs to communicate to Pro Tools that it should suspend any volume automation on the track while you're moving the fader. Otherwise any recorded automation would compete with the changes you were making.
When converting from simply Midi CC faders to HUI, we typically don't receive any information from the MIDI device on whether or not you're touching the fader. This means, we can't tell Pro Tools when to suspend automation for the track, because we simply don't get that information (from Akai MPK 249 for example).
The problem also goes the other way. Without motorized faders, we also cannot tell the Akai MPK 249 where the current volume level is at. So the physical faders will 99.9% of the time be in the wrong position, not indicating the actual level inside the DAW, simply because they can only be moved by your fingers, there's no feedback.
Finally, the HUI protocol is limited to 8 tracks. This is the part that actually maps pretty well to the Akai MPK 249's 8 faders. Just be aware that you can bank to different tracks in Pro Tools, to select which tracks should be controlled by the HUI protocol (and, effectively, your Akai device).
Depending on the workflows you're interested in using this for, these limitations may be ok. But they're important to be aware of.
The scripts we quoted above may look a bit scary, but we could wrap those in a template to make them a little easier to manage for users who don't know Javascript.
To actually use the scripts to control faders in Pro Tools, you'll first need to know which Midi CC's are being sent via your faders. If they're all in a sequence, you can use the script above with almost no modification, it just wants the number of the first CC in the first line of the script (and then set numberOfFaders to 8).
If you can tell us a bit more about your workflow, how you work, if you use automation, and how your session setup looks like, we may be able to guide you more thoroughly.
- Christian Scheuer @chrscheuer2020-12-19 13:43:36.025Z
Two more things:
You mentioned: Before you commit to a subscription. Note, you can always get a free 30-day trial :)
What do you intend to use the knobs for? To control pan? Or to control other things?
- Christian Scheuer @chrscheuer2020-12-19 13:56:00.490Z
I've made a template here that could help make it a little more intuitive to set up.
- In reply tochrscheuer⬆:RRick Kilbashian @Rick_Kilbashian
Hi Christian and all help!
The Akai Faders are important to me because I need a more graceful method to write volume automation than using a trackpad or mouse. The rotary knobs would as you suggest control pan. Again, it's the volume automation with faders that I need to address. Ultimately I'll probably need to get a control surface such as the Avid S1.So from what you've described, SoundFlow acts more as an app that runs in the background and intercepts commands between Pro Tools and the Akai? Is there a lot of memory overhead using SoundFlow?
I can't thank you enough for helping!
Rick
- Christian Scheuer @chrscheuer2020-12-19 17:32:57.610Z
So from what you've described, SoundFlow acts more as an app that runs in the background and intercepts commands between Pro Tools and the Akai?
That would be an accurate description of SF in this particular case, yes. SoundFlow can be used for thousands of other things though :)
Is there a lot of memory overhead using SoundFlow?
No
The Akai Faders are important to me because I need a more graceful method to write volume automation than using a trackpad or mouse. The rotary knobs would as you suggest control pan. Again, it's the volume automation with faders that I need to address. Ultimately I'll probably need to get a control surface such as the Avid S1.
Volume automation using MIDI is hard. If you'd be using the Akai MPK 249 for this, you'd be limited to 128 values for volume, which will cause you to have jumps in the volume automation, because it's simply not accurate enough. 128 values is just 7 bits. This means that resolution-wise you only have the accuracy to describe 42 dB of changes – but, Pro Tools will map those 42 dB over the full range of the track, which goes from -144 dB to +12 dB, ie. 156 dB. In other words, the average number of dB's per MIDI CC value change is 3.7 dB. That's obviously not good. (My math may not be completely accurate here, but practical tests indicate the same issue – you'll get jumps in the volume automation).
Some MIDI controllers adjust for this by using pitch bend messages instead, which are 14 bit, which is better, but still not very accurate.
If I were you, I'd consider getting the Avid Control app on an iPad. It would provide you with a much, much better interface for volume automation, as there is feedback, and it's much more precise than MIDI can ever be.